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stiggywiggy
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 01:19 am |
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HardyHeaven wrote: I think that blowing up abortion clinics is indeed terrorism. It's an intent to cause fear, and an intent to sway public opinion through violent means. If a government condones blowing up abortion clinics, simply because some people don't agree with the laws that state that it is perfectly legal to have an abortion, women who desire to go to such clinics are going to be in fear.
I don't care about your analogy. Abortion is still legal in this country, at least it was the last time I checked. You're basically condoning the vigilante who doesn't like the fact that abortion is legal.
I don't like businesses that clean people's carpets. Those chemicals are harmful to the poor little dustmites who count on dirty carpets in which they live. If I started a rampage across America, bombing carpet cleaning businesses, would you not consider me to be a terrorist?
If you bombed carpet cleaning businesses at NIGHT, you mean? When no one was there to actually BE terrorized?
No, I'd just consider you to be a dumbass who had weird priorities. Now that I've answered your question, answer mine: Would you consider someone who bombed a (hypothetical) legal infanticide clinic to be a terrorist?
I'd consider him to be a hero.
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stiggywiggy
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 01:24 am |
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limana wrote: stiggywiggy wrote: Oh, and by the way, did Palin write a book blurb for an abortion clinic bomber? Did she kick off her campaign for governor in the living room of Eric Rudolph? Did I miss something?
Yes, as usual.
This thread is about the term "terrorism," not about your revered Sarah's company.
Well limana, looks like ya done screwed up again. No wonder you like your new sig with my quote. Maybe you're subconciously admitting all the blunders of which you're aware, and are confessing them through me. I'm flattered and glad to oblige.
Anyway, check out the very post which spawned this very thread, fer Christ sake.
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HardyHeaven
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 01:26 am |
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stiggywiggy wrote: HardyHeaven wrote: I think that blowing up abortion clinics is indeed terrorism. It's an intent to cause fear, and an intent to sway public opinion through violent means. If a government condones blowing up abortion clinics, simply because some people don't agree with the laws that state that it is perfectly legal to have an abortion, women who desire to go to such clinics are going to be in fear.
I don't care about your analogy. Abortion is still legal in this country, at least it was the last time I checked. You're basically condoning the vigilante who doesn't like the fact that abortion is legal.
I don't like businesses that clean people's carpets. Those chemicals are harmful to the poor little dustmites who count on dirty carpets in which they live. If I started a rampage across America, bombing carpet cleaning businesses, would you not consider me to be a terrorist?
If you bombed carpet cleaning businesses at NIGHT, you mean? When no one was there to actually BE terrorized?
And again I ask, what makes you think that terrorists only bomb abortion clinics at night? You introduced the idea. Can you support it?
No, I'd just consider you to be a dumbass who had weird priorities. Now that I've answered your question, answer mine: Would you consider someone who bombed a (hypothetical) legal infanticide clinic to be a terrorist?
I'd consider him to be a hero.
I'd consider him to be a vigilante terrorist who doesn't want to work through legal channels to change the laws he disagrees with.
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stiggywiggy
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 01:31 am |
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HardyHeaven wrote: And again I ask, what makes you think that terrorists only bomb abortion clinics at night? You introduced the idea. Can you support it?
Support what? That SOME abortion clinic bombers (most in fact) bomb abortion clinics at night? Yeah, you know I can. And those are the ones I'm talking about. Didn't you read what I wrote. I was only speaking of them. THEY are not terrorists. Empty buildings cannot experience terror.
No, I'd just consider you to be a dumbass who had weird priorities. Now that I've answered your question, answer mine: Would you consider someone who bombed a (hypothetical) legal infanticide clinic to be a terrorist?
I'd consider him to be a hero.
I'd consider him to be a vigilante terrorist who doesn't want to work through legal channels to change the laws he disagrees with.
I see. So you'd put your trust in the "legal channels" of a society that condoned killing infant children. You'd wait until those wise legal channels changed the laws, and tough shit for the babies who are killed during the years of legal wrangling?
Last edited on Sun Oct 26th, 2008 01:32 am by stiggywiggy
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HardyHeaven
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 01:46 am |
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stiggywiggy wrote: HardyHeaven wrote: And again I ask, what makes you think that terrorists only bomb abortion clinics at night? You introduced the idea. Can you support it?
Support what? That SOME abortion clinic bombers (most in fact) bomb abortion clinics at night? Yeah, you know I can. And those are the ones I'm talking about. Didn't you read what I wrote. I was only speaking of them. THEY are not terrorists. Empty buildings cannot experience terror.
If you admit that SOME or MOST bomb abortion clinics at night only, then you're also admitting that there are SOME also, who bomb abortion clinics during the day.
The fact SOME bomb during the day is certainly enough to instill fear in those who may consider entering a perfectly legal abortion clinic.
What is your point anyway?
No, I'd just consider you to be a dumbass who had weird priorities. Now that I've answered your question, answer mine: Would you consider someone who bombed a (hypothetical) legal infanticide clinic to be a terrorist?
I'd consider him to be a hero.
I'd consider him to be a vigilante terrorist who doesn't want to work through legal channels to change the laws he disagrees with.
I see. So you'd put your trust in the "legal channels" of a society that condoned killing infant children. You'd wait until those wise legal channels changed the laws, and tough shit for the babies who are killed during the years of legal wrangling?
Are you now going so far as to endorse the bombing of abortion clinics, Stiggy?!? Surely not!! 
By that logic, you should also endorse Hamas and AlQueida. After all, why should they sit around and wait for America to retract it's bad laws that endorse religious freedom, since they obviously do not respect the great Allah.
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Sally-Anne
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:02 am |
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Bombing abortion clinics is terrorism. End of story.
You wont ever see me condoning or agreeing with terrorism, not from anyone and not for any reason, cause, or agenda. If that puts me out in the cold from my Christian brothers in here, so be it. I don't agree with terroristic violence against civilians like that. It is evil and so is abortion.
The end.
Last edited on Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:19 am by Sally-Anne
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stiggywiggy
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:07 am |
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HardyHeaven wrote: stiggywiggy wrote: HardyHeaven wrote: And again I ask, what makes you think that terrorists only bomb abortion clinics at night? You introduced the idea. Can you support it?
Support what? That SOME abortion clinic bombers (most in fact) bomb abortion clinics at night? Yeah, you know I can. And those are the ones I'm talking about. Didn't you read what I wrote. I was only speaking of them. THEY are not terrorists. Empty buildings cannot experience terror.
If you admit that SOME or MOST bomb abortion clinics at night only, then you're also admitting that there are SOME also, who bomb abortion clinics during the day.
What do you mean admit it? I never denied it or implied otherwise.
The fact SOME bomb during the day is certainly enough to instill fear in those who may consider entering a perfectly legal abortion clinic.
What is your point anyway?
That buildings cannot be terrorized. People can. That's why I typed this to declin:
You're right. Elements of fear among those who are not the target might ensue. But if I lived in nazi Germany in 1938, and I saw that a new gas oven for Jews was being constructed, I might attempt to blow it up. My motive would be to save Jews, NOT to terrorize nazis, even though some nazis might become fearful by my act.
But I don't think I'd consider myself a terrorist in that hypothetical scenario. Would you?
That's what I asked declin. What would you say?
No, I'd just consider you to be a dumbass who had weird priorities. Now that I've answered your question, answer mine: Would you consider someone who bombed a (hypothetical) legal infanticide clinic to be a terrorist?
I'd consider him to be a hero.
I'd consider him to be a vigilante terrorist who doesn't want to work through legal channels to change the laws he disagrees with.
I see. So you'd put your trust in the "legal channels" of a society that condoned killing infant children. You'd wait until those wise legal channels changed the laws, and tough shit for the babies who are killed during the years of legal wrangling?
Are you now going so far as to endorse the bombing of abortion clinics, Stiggy?!? Surely not!!
Where did I do that? Let's stick to the subject. Are you telling me that you'd put your trust in the "legal channels" of a society that condoned killing infant children? You'd wait until those wise legal channels changed the laws, and tough shit for the babies who are killed during the years of legal wrangling?
By that logic, you should also endorse Hamas and AlQueida.
By what logic? Whose logic are you using? Maybe if you can tell me where I endorsed anything, you can then tell me what logic I used in doing so, and how that logic relates to Hamas and AlQaida blowing up human beings.
Last edited on Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:08 am by stiggywiggy
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Sally-Anne
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:09 am |
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Aldaron wrote: You still watching, Sally? There's three on this board already who don't think blowing up people and buildings are acts of terrorism.
Yeah, and I'm rather shocked, I didn't imagine that any of them would be trying to paint it and justify it as anything else.
I vehemently disagree with them. That's all I have to say on the matter.
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stiggywiggy
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:11 am |
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Sally-Anne wrote:
Bombing abortion clinics is terrorism. End of story.
You wont ever see me condoning or agreeing with terrorism, not from anyone and not for any reason, cause, or agenda. If that puts me out in the cold from my Christian brothers in here, so be it. I don't agree with terroristic violence against civilians like that. It is evil and so it abortion.
The end.
So let me ask you:
If I lived in nazi Germany in 1943, and I saw that a new gas oven for Jews was being constructed, I might attempt to blow it up. My motive would be to save Jews, NOT to terrorize nazis, even though some nazis might become fearful by my act.
But I don't think I'd consider myself a terrorist in that hypothetical scenario. Would you?
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Sally-Anne
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:12 am |
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HardyHeaven wrote: I think that blowing up abortion clinics is indeed terrorism.
So do I, and I'm shocked that all the Christian guys in here who I love and respect, Josh, X, Cajun, and Stiggy, are disagreeing.
I guess I'll just have to live with it.
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manonfire
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:12 am |
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| I'm against bombing abortion clinics. We need to arrest the abortion doctors who have made a lucrative profession from murdering unborn children. Then, try them for murder in a court of law.
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stiggywiggy
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:12 am |
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Sally-Anne wrote: Aldaron wrote: You still watching, Sally? There's three on this board already who don't think blowing up people and buildings are acts of terrorism.
Yeah, and I'm rather shocked, I didn't imagine that any of them would be trying to paint it and justify it as anything else.
I vehemently disagree with them. That's all I have to say on the matter.
Except I'm not among them, and I don't think Wayne, JR and Cajun are either. I even specified NO PEOPLE!! I also called the bombers dumbasses. That's an ENDORSEMENT?
Last edited on Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:16 am by stiggywiggy
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Sally-Anne
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:18 am |
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stiggywiggy wrote: Sally-Anne wrote: Aldaron wrote: You still watching, Sally? There's three on this board already who don't think blowing up people and buildings are acts of terrorism.
Yeah, and I'm rather shocked, I didn't imagine that any of them would be trying to paint it and justify it as anything else.
I vehemently disagree with them. That's all I have to say on the matter.
Except I'm not among them, and I don't think Wayne, JR and Cajun are either. I even specified NO PEOPLE!! I also called the bombers dumbasses. That's an ENDORSEMENT?
Oh sorry, please accept my apologies, I thought you agreed. Ok, it's only Josh, X, and Cajun then.
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stiggywiggy
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:20 am |
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Sally-Anne wrote: stiggywiggy wrote: Sally-Anne wrote: Aldaron wrote: You still watching, Sally? There's three on this board already who don't think blowing up people and buildings are acts of terrorism.
Yeah, and I'm rather shocked, I didn't imagine that any of them would be trying to paint it and justify it as anything else.
I vehemently disagree with them. That's all I have to say on the matter.
Except I'm not among them, and I don't think Wayne, JR and Cajun are either. I even specified NO PEOPLE!! I also called the bombers dumbasses. That's an ENDORSEMENT?
Oh sorry, please accept my apologies, I thought you agreed. Ok, it's only Josh, X, and Cajun then.
No problem. But since you thought wrong about me. maybe you're thinking wrong about them too. Where do you see any of the three defending the bombing of people, much less endorsing it?
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Sally-Anne
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:26 am |
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stiggywiggy wrote: Sally-Anne wrote: stiggywiggy wrote: Sally-Anne wrote: Aldaron wrote: You still watching, Sally? There's three on this board already who don't think blowing up people and buildings are acts of terrorism.
Yeah, and I'm rather shocked, I didn't imagine that any of them would be trying to paint it and justify it as anything else.
I vehemently disagree with them. That's all I have to say on the matter.
Except I'm not among them, and I don't think Wayne, JR and Cajun are either. I even specified NO PEOPLE!! I also called the bombers dumbasses. That's an ENDORSEMENT?
Oh sorry, please accept my apologies, I thought you agreed. Ok, it's only Josh, X, and Cajun then.
No problem. But since you thought wrong about me. maybe you're thinking wrong about them too. Where do you see any of the three defending the bombing of people, much less endorsing it?
I didn't say they were defending it or even endorsing it. But trying to argue that it isn't terrorism, is, in my opinion, justifying something. You may disagree with me, that's ok, but I regard it terrorism and I wont be dressing it up or justifying it as anything else.
Last edited on Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:26 am by Sally-Anne
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HardyHeaven
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:31 am |
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stiggywiggy wrote: HardyHeaven wrote: stiggywiggy wrote: HardyHeaven wrote: And again I ask, what makes you think that terrorists only bomb abortion clinics at night? You introduced the idea. Can you support it?
Support what? That SOME abortion clinic bombers (most in fact) bomb abortion clinics at night? Yeah, you know I can. And those are the ones I'm talking about. Didn't you read what I wrote. I was only speaking of them. THEY are not terrorists. Empty buildings cannot experience terror.
If you admit that SOME or MOST bomb abortion clinics at night only, then you're also admitting that there are SOME also, who bomb abortion clinics during the day.
What do you mean admit it? I never denied it or implied otherwise.
If you want to mincemeat, allow me to re-phrase:
Stiggy, since you stated that SOME bombings occur at night, then you are also admitting that OTHER bombings must happen during the day, thereby leading to the potential that some who attend abortion clinic facilities MIGHT feel threatened by the potential of being terrorized.
The fact SOME bomb during the day is certainly enough to instill fear in those who may consider entering a perfectly legal abortion clinic.
What is your point anyway?
That buildings cannot be terrorized. People can. That's why I typed this to declin:
You're right. Elements of fear among those who are not the target might ensue. But if I lived in nazi Germany in 1938, and I saw that a new gas oven for Jews was being constructed, I might attempt to blow it up. My motive would be to save Jews, NOT to terrorize nazis, even though some nazis might become fearful by my act.
But I don't think I'd consider myself a terrorist in that hypothetical scenario. Would you?
That's what I asked declin. What would you say?
Ahhh, I see where I made my fatal mistake. I thought you said that initially to me, not to Declin. At which time I answered you with my own little analogy about poor dustmites and evil carpet cleaning companies.
But since you're insisting that I provide a clearer answer, here it is:
HaHa! Gotcha!! lol. I already gave my answer. Deal with it.
No, I'd just consider you to be a dumbass who had weird priorities. Now that I've answered your question, answer mine: Would you consider someone who bombed a (hypothetical) legal infanticide clinic to be a terrorist?
I'd consider him to be a hero.
I'd consider him to be a vigilante terrorist who doesn't want to work through legal channels to change the laws he disagrees with.
I see. So you'd put your trust in the "legal channels" of a society that condoned killing infant children. You'd wait until those wise legal channels changed the laws, and tough shit for the babies who are killed during the years of legal wrangling?
Are you now going so far as to endorse the bombing of abortion clinics, Stiggy?!? Surely not!!
Where did I do that? Let's stick to the subject. Are you telling me that you'd put your trust in the "legal channels" of a society that condoned killing infant children? You'd wait until those wise legal channels changed the laws, and tough shit for the babies who are killed during the years of legal wrangling?
No, I'm not talking about your analogy. The subject is not gas chambers for jews or killing infants. The subject is whether blowing up an abortion clinic is a terrorist act. I say it is. I say that people who don't follow the laws of this society, who take matters into their own hands by use of violence are terrrorists.
By that logic, you should also endorse Hamas and AlQueida.
By what logic? Whose logic are you using? Maybe if you can tell me where I endorsed anything, you can then tell me what logic I used in doing so, and how that logic relates to Hamas and AlQaida blowing up human beings.
No thanks. This is the part of the evening where I look up, see a cord, and pull it, thereby signalling to the bus driver that this is my stop, and it's time for me to get off.
I don't enjoy discussing things with you, Stiggy. Too many twists and turns. Reminds me of a corn maze. I hate those.
I've been told that doing the same thing over and over, all the while expecting a different result, is one of the definitions of insanity. I choose to remain sane this evening. Life is too short (or long, depending on how you look at it  ) to waste a whole evening stiggying. **shrug**
Bus driver!!
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stiggywiggy
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:49 am |
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HardyHeaven wrote: stiggywiggy wrote: If you admit that SOME or MOST bomb abortion clinics at night only, then you're also admitting that there are SOME also, who bomb abortion clinics during the day.
What do you mean admit it? I never denied it or implied otherwise.
If you want to mincemeat, allow me to re-phrase:
Stiggy, since you stated that SOME bombings occur at night, then you are also admitting that OTHER bombings must happen during the day, thereby leading to the potential that some who attend abortion clinic facilities MIGHT feel threatened by the potential of being terrorized.
Right. They'd feel threatened by the bombers who are bombing PEOPLE. Why would they feel threatened by those who are bombing buildings at 3 am, unless they were planning on being in the bulding at that time?
The fact SOME bomb during the day is certainly enough to instill fear in those who may consider entering a perfectly legal abortion clinic.
What is your point anyway?
That buildings cannot be terrorized. People can. That's why I typed this to declin:
You're right. Elements of fear among those who are not the target might ensue. But if I lived in nazi Germany in 1938, and I saw that a new gas oven for Jews was being constructed, I might attempt to blow it up. My motive would be to save Jews, NOT to terrorize nazis, even though some nazis might become fearful by my act.
But I don't think I'd consider myself a terrorist in that hypothetical scenario. Would you?
That's what I asked declin. What would you say?
Ahhh, I see where I made my fatal mistake. I thought you said that initially to me, not to Declin. At which time I answered you with my own little analogy about poor dustmites and evil carpet cleaning companies.
But since you're insisting that I provide a clearer answer, here it is:
HaHa! Gotcha!! lol. I already gave my answer. Deal with it.
But you didn't, so let me ask you again:
If I lived in nazi Germany in 1938, and I saw that a new gas oven for Jews was being constructed, I might attempt to blow it up. My motive would be to save Jews, NOT to terrorize nazis, even though some nazis might become fearful by my act.
But I don't think I'd consider myself a terrorist in that hypothetical scenario. Would you?
A simple yes or no will do.
No, I'd just consider you to be a dumbass who had weird priorities. Now that I've answered your question, answer mine: Would you consider someone who bombed a (hypothetical) legal infanticide clinic to be a terrorist?
I'd consider him to be a hero.
I'd consider him to be a vigilante terrorist who doesn't want to work through legal channels to change the laws he disagrees with.
I see. So you'd put your trust in the "legal channels" of a society that condoned killing infant children. You'd wait until those wise legal channels changed the laws, and tough shit for the babies who are killed during the years of legal wrangling?
Are you now going so far as to endorse the bombing of abortion clinics, Stiggy?!? Surely not!!
Where did I do that? Let's stick to the subject. Are you telling me that you'd put your trust in the "legal channels" of a society that condoned killing infant children? You'd wait until those wise legal channels changed the laws, and tough shit for the babies who are killed during the years of legal wrangling?
No, I'm not talking about your analogy. The subject is not gas chambers for jews or killing infants. The subject is whether blowing up an abortion clinic is a terrorist act. I say it is.
Yeah. That's been established. And I say it isn't. Do you think that blowing up a legal and unoccupied infanticide clinic would be a terrorist act?
I say that people who don't follow the laws of this society, who take matters into their own hands by use of violence are terrrorists.
Fine. As long as you recognize that you now find northern abolitionists in the 1800's and French resistance fighters in 1943 occupied France to be terrorists.
I don't enjoy discussing things with you, Stiggy.
I wouldn't imagine so. And that being the case, you can always decline sending me posts or replies. That's what I do with people I don't want to discuss stuff with.
Last edited on Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:51 am by stiggywiggy
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HardyHeaven
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:54 am |
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stiggywiggy wrote: I wouldn't imagine so. And that being the case, you can always decline sending me posts or replies. That's what I do with people I don't want to discuss stuff with.
Sending you posts or replies? Snert. 
mmmm, ok then ....
I'll try to refrain from sending you any posts or replies in the future, hon.
**smooches**
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Sally-Anne
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:55 am |
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stiggywiggy wrote: HardyHeaven wrote: Attacks on doctors who practice abortion and on family planning clinics in the United States in the 1980s and 1990s left several people dead and scores wounded.
That's terrorism. The subject here was blowing up buildings, not doctors.
So what? The French tried to blow up the Rainbow Warrior, human beings were never the target. But oops, they accidentally murdered a photographer in the process who was on it. But by your argument it wasn't really terrorism because they didn't mean to kill anyone. Whatever.
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stiggywiggy
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Posted: Sun Oct 26th, 2008 02:57 am |
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HardyHeaven wrote: stiggywiggy wrote: I wouldn't imagine so. And that being the case, you can always decline sending me posts or replies. That's what I do with people I don't want to discuss stuff with.
Sending you posts or replies? Snert.
mmmm, ok then ....
I'll try to refrain from sending you any posts or replies in the future, hon.
**smooches**
Good. I like you. I'd hate to see you doing something you admit you don't like doing.
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